Q: Canon 30D / 400D thoughts?

[Desmond]

I know I am being really slack here, but will ask on people's opinions on the 30D or 400D Canon dSLRs...

I have been given an opportunity (although I was waiting for the SD14 but no-one has mentioned anything to that post) to obtain a dSLR at a very good price.

I had a professional animal photographer comment on my work and encourage me to go dSLR, apparently I will *never* look back once I go dSLR especially in the field of Animal photography. I was thrilled at the email I got from them, and saw some of their shots. Much like mine, but with a lot less noise and sharper definition.

On the basics I know that the 400D has more megapixels, but that's around all. I will do some of my own research over the next few days but if anyone, ANYONE (?) has any comments/experience etc that they would like to share.. NOW IS THE TIME!!!

I already have a few filters and lenses of the 58mm variety, I am led to believe that these will work with most lenses available for the Canon lenses.

I really like the 1D that is in the Classifieds, not in my price league though ...

Des.

[Ronald S. Jr.]

Well I sold the 1DMkIIN, so you don't have to be tempted by it anymore.

Now...as for the 30D vs. 400D. The 400D will get the job done, no question. However, I personally wouldn't so much as sneeze in its general direction. That's my opinion. Compared to the 30D you can get for just a couple hundred more, it's an easy decision to make. First off, everything takes too darn long to adjust on the Rebels, imo. You have to press a button and take the camera away and go through the menu to change ISO, FEC, EC, and so many other things. Second, there's no top screen. I hate that. One of the major things about the 20D/30D is that there's the wheel on the back, called the "quick control dial". The layout of the buttons on the XXD is so much easier, it's silly. Everything is just touch a button and spin the wheel. Easy, comfortable, and intuitive.

Oh, and when you add megapixels on the same size sensor, it adds noise. Smaller pixels have more noise. You're looking to lower the noise in your shots, not raise it.

I'll also say, though, that noise is largely dependent on your exposure. Get the exposure dead on (or darn near), and you'll rarely see noise in your shots, regardless of ISO.

[Adaptive]

One of the major things about the 20D/30D is that there's the wheel on the back, called the "quick control dial". The layout of the buttons on the XXD is so much easier, it's silly. Everything is just touch a button and spin the wheel. Easy, comfortable, and intuitive.

Oh, and when you add megapixels on the same size sensor, it adds noise. Smaller pixels have more noise.

2 great points. I'd suggest going to a store that sells cameras and holding both cameras, trying them out and getting a feel for them. I'm sure after playing around with them both for a little while you will agree with Ronald and I and say that the 30D is better. After holding the 30D you will look at the 400d like it's a toy. Don't let the guy behind the counter talk you into buying.... You're just there to try it out. If they get a bonus for selling 400d's that month they will be pushing that thing on your BIG TIME. Plus they usually "throw in" these added goodies which usually are nothing but junk. If you live in the states and you're comfortable buying online that would be my suggestion.

Also I don't know if you're willing to wait.... But usually the best time to buy camera bodies (IMO) is in the spring because that's the time new bodies are released usually. There's been alot of buzz about a 30d replacement already! This will be good for you if you are looking to buy a 30d because 30d owners will probably be selling their bodies for money towards an upgrade and the market will be flooded with people trying to sell used 30d's the prices will probably be around $600-$700. If you look now you can even find some used 30d's going for $750 already!!!

[Desmond]

Let me have a *cold* shower and get back to this thread...

This is the first time I have held any dSLR camera and got excited...

[Desmond]

2 great points. I'd suggest going to a store that sells cameras and holding both cameras, trying them out and getting a feel for them. I'm sure after playing around with them both for a little while you will agree with Ronald and I and say that the 30D is better. After holding the 30D you will look at the 400d like it's a toy. Don't let the guy behind the counter talk you into buying.... You're just there to try it out. If they get a bonus for selling 400d's that month they will be pushing that thing on your BIG TIME. Plus they usually "throw in" these added goodies which usually are nothing but junk. If you live in the states and you're comfortable buying online that would be my suggestion.

Also I don't know if you're willing to wait.... But usually the best time to buy camera bodies (IMO) is in the spring because that's the time new bodies are released usually. There's been alot of buzz about a 30d replacement already! This will be good for you if you are looking to buy a 30d because 30d owners will probably be selling their bodies for money towards an upgrade and the market will be flooded with people trying to sell used 30d's the prices will probably be around $600-$700. If you look now you can even find some used 30d's going for $750 already!!!

Okay, tonight after work I did head out to 'play' with both. Now, remember that I started this as a 'possible' hobby in April 06 and first time holding a SLR... I had to wipe the drool off my face picking up the Rebel. The Rebel is much like my camera though, not many improvements, more megapixels (which I really don't feel I require) and lighter, and was quite happy with it. The drawback I got told with this is that it uses a 'short back lens' or something like that so I am limited to the lenses I use with it, especially if I change bodies (camera that is) and want to keep the same lenses. The wasted LCD monitor at the back to display settings was USELESS in the sunlight, I struggled to read the LCD settings in the daylight (I am not criticising the camera, just my thoughts on it)... Although the display was big I felt that all that could be put into a normal LCD, saving more energy and better readability...

Took a little convincing to get them to let me *touch* the 30D. I guess I should have dressed better LOL as they said that would cost *a lot more* than the 400D/Rebel and should just consider going the Rebel as I am used to the S2is...

So, I picked up the 30D. VERY SOLID. Very secure and very nice fit in the hand. I love how you can operate just about everything with your right hand (so if you are left handed it will be real fun! Only the intelligent are left handed, right ). Within about 30 seconds I got the hang of the intelligence of layout of every control you want, at your fingertips.

The top display is REALLY handy, and can be read in extreme lighting conditions and quickly navigated through.

The burst mode, <<jaw drops>>. What can I say? The sound of the shutter going off like that is awesome. I got 32 pics in around 6 seconds.

The focusing on dSLR's is so quick compared to my now 'toy' camera. And the near instantaneous shots are something I had never experienced before.

Also with this camera there was the same thing about the short back lenses, I am now unsure to just get the body or to buy the IS USM lens kit with it. I am leaning toward a L series lens, actually two. That will do me for now.

"Click-Click-Click-Click-Click-Click-Click-Click-Click-Click ... wow..."

Many people who suggested from my shots from various places are right, once you go dSLR you won't regret it. Also timtam pointed out that "it wouldn't be a waste of money, and the novelty hasn't worn off with photography... if anything, you've become more involved..." Scary but true. I have done over 18000 pics with my camera learning how to use it (from the counter that I have neer reset on the S2 is)

The guy at the counter was pushing the 400D still, until he saw a glimpse of two Visa Gold cards , then he suggested the 400D (again) with the stupidly horrendous 200mm (?) IS USM lens and said I can get a $500 cashback on that, so the lens only cost me $1300. Same as what the 400D was going for!!! Obviously there are kickbacks for this month, he really wanted me to walk out the store with the 400D... so I bought my $5 lenscap to replace today's chew toy one (with the Gold card just to annoy them LOL) and left...

Thanks for all your suggestions. Looks like the 30D will be my camera ... soon.

Des.

[timtam]

W.O.W... that's all I can say!

[Desmond]

Oh, and the 30D has spot metering, which I have grown used to on my S2is and has saved many a photo that I have taken, so that was a no-brainer which one to choose.

Des.

[Adaptive]

As I was coming to the end of your novel I started getting nervous especially around the time you said he was pushing the 400d and you had your visa in your hand. I was like "nooooooooooooooooo" hahaha.

But yeah, it's good you got to test out both bodies before you made your decision, that's always the best way. You wouldnt buy a car without test driving it first right?

If you want L lenses there's nothing wrong with that but there are many many many great inexpensive lenses out there and you can always upgrade. You don't have to start off buying all L lenses. If that's your plan I hope you have at least $2000+ in your pockets right now. $1000 for the body and $1000+ for a lens. If you do have that kind of money I suggest getting the 24-70L first. Actually you can find them used for $900-$1000, probably the most used lens you will own. But if you don't want to spend that kind of money there are other lenses with the same focal length that will do you just fine.

[Desmond]

As I was coming to the end of your novel I started getting nervous especially around the time you said he was pushing the 400d and you had your visa in your hand. I was like "nooooooooooooooooo" hahaha.

But yeah, it's good you got to test out both bodies before you made your decision, that's always the best way. You wouldnt buy a car without test driving it first right?

If you want L lenses there's nothing wrong with that but there are many many many great inexpensive lenses out there and you can always upgrade. You don't have to start off buying all L lenses. If that's your plan I hope you have at least $2000+ in your pockets right now. $1000 for the body and $1000+ for a lens. If you do have that kind of money I suggest getting the 24-70L first. Actually you can find them used for $900-$1000, probably the most used lens you will own. But if you don't want to spend that kind of money there are other lenses with the same focal length that will do you just fine.

Actually in AUD the guy wanted $2200 for the body!!! I can get the body for less than $1000 and really did allocate around $3500 AUD for the camera and a few lenses.

I think they wanted to see how much they could push me away and get me to get the 400D.

Is there a special cashback for US at the moment on the 30D? Lots of eBay sellers are advertising it as having cashback? I am assuming I am not eligible for cashback in Australia through where I am buying from (Canon direct).

Des.

[Ronald S. Jr.]

Yep, you can get $100 rebate on the 30D, or $200 if you buy another eligible item, along with the double rebate amount for that item.

First off, the XTi (400D) only costs like 800 bucks. The 30D isn't even 1100. I don't know what lens in hell he was trying to sell you on, unless it was the 70-200 f/4L IS, which is a fantastic lens, but even then, it's about $1050, not $1300. I know prices are higher outside the US, but you should still be able to get better prices than that. Don't let a salesman talk you into lenses. I was in sales for a few years. Not to sound cocky, but I could sell snowballs to an eskimo. Doesn't mean I know what I'm talking about. talk to us. Tell us what you shoot, what you want, and what you want to spend. We'll help you figure out what you need.

Best of luck.